An eclectic collection of trivia, observation, cynicism, wit....
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I'm Mark. Older than you imagine, pescetarian, husband, father, professional parent & pedant.

I post some original stuff and a bunch of other things that I like. If you own the rights to something you see here and you're not happy about me sharing it, let me know.

machistado:

mings replied to your post:Props to anyone who actually reads that giant post…

I read it right through. I’d only take issue with a couple of things. (1) The Nazi movement was a relative minority that the majority of Germans despised. Fear kept them submissive. Ergo, (2) I very much doubt whether Germans hate you at all.

I think it’s pretty reductive to say that the majority of Germans despised the Nazis. There were those active in the Nazi Party and those who actively resisted the Nazi movement (like Oscar Schindler) who comprised of a slightly small minority. There were those who were active collaborators, i.e. vibrant supporters of the Nazi Party who comprised a large minority in Germany and then there was the disputed passive non-resistant majority. This majority knew exactly what was going on. Perhaps they didn’t dance down the street with the active collaborators wearing swastika armbands but this silent majority is why the Holocaust happened.  I have a serious problem with Nazi Germany (and this is why Germans hate me) because I don’t understand how an industrialized country in the 20th century could allow for mass murder. I understand how fear worked in Nazi Germany and I understand that people didn’t want to be targeted by the Nazis for being dissidents but I think historians give the German people far too much leeway in this regard.

You saw people being loaded onto train cars, you knew where they were going, and you said nothing? 

You are, of course, entitled to your view and I respect that. In many respects I agree with the arguments that you make. I disagree that I’m being reductive. We live in different times now and people are less afraid of making statements that they might once have been.

You are absolutely correct to say that the silent majority effectively allowed the Holocaust to happen. Nonetheless, oppression is all about a much feared minority using extreme bullying tactics to manipulate and control a majority. In the case of war, it is a far simpler matter to simply murder dissenters than dilute resources by imprisoning them. When things reach that level, then yes, ordinary people fear a murderous minority. Their survival instinct kicks in and they look the other way rather than risk their lives or worse, those of their families.

You ask how people said nothing about the trains to the death camps. I ask you how Robert Mugabe is still in power, when the whole of the civilised world knows what he represents?

We have recently seen popular uprising overthrow savage dictators, who for years (in some cases decades) did the same as Hitler, up to and including genocide. No one intervened.

The fundamental difference now is communication. Twitter and other similar media make traditional censorship almost impossible. With knowledge comes power and the dictators find it increasingly difficult to quell unrest without resorting to utter brutality. The situation in Syria currently underlines that.

I’m English. I live in a part of England that was known as Hellfire Corner because of the constant pounding it took during WWII. My father and my uncle both fought the Germans in the last war, and both were nearly killed. My uncle, who later witnessed the liberation of the death camps, was unable to forget what he saw and died recently without being able to forgive the Germans.

I’ve had the pleasure of doing business with many German companies. Without exception, every German that I’ve met of my generation and later has viewed the actions of the Nazi movement with as much revulsion as the rest of the world.

Today’s Germans are not the people who perpetrated the Holocaust. We, and they, should never forget what happened. It’s part of our history and it can never be changed, but we also need to move on and look forward to a better future.

  1. fossoaposto said: damn straight.
  2. mings reblogged this from machistado and added:
    You are, of course, entitled to your view and I respect that. In many respects I agree with the arguments that you make....
  3. machistado posted this